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David Kirk's 'embarrassing' All Blacks verdict and his RWC 2023 tip

(Photo by Julian Finney/Getty Images)

David Kirk has branded last weekend’s record defeat for the All Blacks as embarrassing – but he can still see them winning Rugby World Cup 2023 even though he doesn’t see them as favourites.

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New Zealand stopped off in London en route to the finals in France only to suffer a painful 7-35 Twickenham hammering against the Springboks.

That result has led to Kirk – the 1987 All Blacks World Cup winning captain – reappraising his thoughts on South Africa heading into the tournament, believing they are now a big threat to retain the title they won in Japan in 2019.

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As for New Zealand, who open their campaign on September 8 versus France in Paris, as hurtful as he believes the loss in England to the Boks was, Kirk hasn’t lost all belief that Ian Foster’s side can still emerge as champions when the final is held in Paris on October 28.

Asked by rugbyworldcup.com for his thoughts on the five-tries-to-one hammering at English rugby HQ, Kirk replied: “There is no way the All Blacks are going to play that badly again.

Team Form

Last 5 Games

4
Wins
4
2
Streak
1
21
Tries Scored
21
63
Points Difference
76
4/5
First Try
2/5
5/5
First Points
0/5
4/5
Race To 10 Points
3/5

“It was embarrassing and no one likes to be embarrassed and no one likes to know they have let the team down badly. There are no excuses and they won’t be looking for excuses, they will just be angry with themselves and know that they will have to do better.

“What I think it has made clear – to them and to other people – you have to be able to play in with a level of physical presence and intensity and accuracy, particularly in the forwards, for a long period of time. You have to keep going back to the well.

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“The All Blacks took the Springboks apart in the first 20 minutes of the Rugby Championship game at Eden Park. They smashed them in the forwards, dominated them in the set-piece and 35 minutes into the game, it was 20-3, and they ended up winning 35-17.

“I remember we were absolutely mauled by the French in the final Test in Nantes, and we hadn’t forgotten that. Another level of physical intensity was required and these All Blacks will have learned that.”

What is his hunch regarding who is going to be crowned Rugby World Cup 2023 champions? “Prior to the South Africa game, I would have dropped them [the Springboks] out of the top three and said Ireland or France or the All Blacks. That result changes things a bit but they will have to play like that more than once.

“The All Blacks can win, and I’d like to see them win, but I don’t think they should be considered the favourites to win. For me, the favourites are France and Ireland and, all things being equal, with both teams playing to the best of their ability and with France at home, France can win.

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“They have contributed a lot to World Cups over the years and it would be nice to see them get some recognition as a world champion.”

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Comments

5 Comments
D
Dr A 445 days ago

I can't understand how a one off pub night out in London over rides two rugby championship titles. A two year thorough dismantling of the Boks offset with a meaningless tomato can match in London.

France will get nailed, Sep 8, my prediction.

S
Sumkunn Tsadmiova 445 days ago

David Kirk. The only person to attend Oxford University with an IQ you have to dig for rather than measure....

B
BMac 446 days ago

Agree with David, last week exposed how weak the RC really is with constant games against Australia. I can see France winning the opening game, their depth and size of their forwards will cause us major problems, our forward pack hasnt quite got it and our ranking of 4th is right. If we lose it just means like SA in 2019 can drop 1 game and play 3 after that and win.

T
Toddy 446 days ago

Spot on davo

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JW 3 hours ago
'Passionate reunion of France and New Zealand shows Fabien Galthie is wrong to rest his stars'

Ok, managed to read the full article..

... New Zealand’s has only 14 and the professional season is all over within four months. In France, club governance is the responsibility of an independent organisation [the Ligue Nationale de Rugby or LNR] which is entirely separate from the host union [the Fédération Française de Rugby or FFR]. Down south New Zealand Rugby runs the provincial and the national game.

That is the National Provincial Championship, a competition of 14 representative union based teams run through the SH international window and only semi professional (paid only during it's running). It is run by NZR and goes for two and a half months.


Super Rugby is a competition involving 12 fully professional teams, of which 5 are of New Zealand eligibility, and another joint administered team of Pacific Island eligibility, with NZR involvement. It was a 18 week competition this year, so involved (randomly chosen I believe) extra return fixtures (2 or 3 home and away derbys), and is run by Super Rugby Pacific's own independent Board (or organisation). The teams may or may not be independently run and owned (note, this does not necessarily mean what you think of as 'privately owned').


LNR was setup by FFR and the French Government to administer the professional game in France. In New Zealand, the Players Association and Super Rugby franchises agreed last month to not setup their own governance structure for professional rugby and re-aligned themselves with New Zealand Rugby. They had been proposing to do something like the English model, I'm not sure how closely that would have been aligned to the French system but it did not sound like it would have French union executive representation on it like the LNR does.

In the shaky isles the professional pyramid tapers to a point with the almighty All Blacks. In France the feeling for country is no more important than the sense of fierce local identity spawned at myriad clubs concentrated in the southwest. Progress is achieved by a nonchalant shrug and the wide sweep of nuanced negotiation, rather than driven from the top by a single intense focus.

Yes, it is pretty much a 'representative' selection system at every level, but these union's are having to fight for their existence against the regime that is NZR, and are currently going through their own battle, just as France has recently as I understand it. A single focus, ala the French game, might not be the best outcome for rugby as a whole.


For pure theatre, it is a wonderful article so far. I prefer 'Ntamack New Zealand 2022' though.

The young Crusader still struggles to solve the puzzle posed by the shorter, more compact tight-heads at this level but he had no problem at all with Colombe.

It was interesting to listen to Manny during an interview on Maul or Nothing, he citied that after a bit of banter with the All Black's he no longer wanted one of their jersey's after the game. One of those talks was an eye to eye chat with Tamaiti Williams, there appear to be nothing between the lock and prop, just a lot of give and take. I thought TW angled in and caused Taylor to pop a few times, and that NZ were lucky to be rewarded.

f you have a forward of 6ft 8ins and 145kg, and he is not at all disturbed by a dysfunctional set-piece, you are in business.

He talked about the clarity of the leadership that helped alleviate any need for anxiety at the predicaments unfolding before him. The same cannot be said for New Zealand when they had 5 minutes left to retrieve a match winning penalty, I don't believe. Did the team in black have much of a plan at any point in the game? I don't really call an autonomous 10 vehicle they had as innovative. I think Razor needs to go back to the dealer and get a new game driver on that one.

Vaa’i is no match for his power on the ground. Even in reverse, Meafou is like a tractor motoring backwards in low gear, trampling all in its path.

Vaa'i actually stops him in his tracks. He gets what could have been a dubious 'tackle' on him?

A high-level offence will often try to identify and exploit big forwards who can be slower to reload, and therefore vulnerable to two quick plays run at them consecutively.

Yes he was just standing on his haunches wasn't he? He mentioned that in the interview, saying that not only did you just get up and back into the line to find the opposition was already set and running at you they also hit harder than anything he'd experienced in the Top 14. He was referring to New Zealands ultra-physical, burst-based Super style of course, which he was more than a bit surprised about. I don't blame him for being caught out.


He still sent the obstruction back to the repair yard though!

What wouldn’t the New Zealand rugby public give to see the likes of Mauvaka and Meafou up front..

Common now Nick, don't go there! Meafou showed his Toulouse shirt and promptly got his citizenship, New Zealand can't have him, surely?!?


As I have said before with these subjects, really enjoy your enthusiasm for their contribution on the field and I'd love to see more of their shapes running out for Vern Cotter and the like styled teams.

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