1
England would 'absolutely' have won 'by plenty' if not for red card
By Ian Cameron
Former England international Vicky Fleetwood believes England would have lifted the Rugby World Cup in Eden Park with ease if it weren’t for a first-half red card after just 18 minutes of the first half.
ADVERTISEMENT
Lydia Thompson was shown a red card after barrelling into Portia Woodman, a hit that also brought the New Zealander’s final to a premature end. The Black Ferns great was taken off the pitch on the a medical cart, an ignominious end to her tournament.
The tackle was referred to TMO Ben Whitehouse by referee Hollie Davidson, before Davidson could be heard saying: “For me it’s clear head on head, she’s coming across at speed, it’s a reckless action, so it’s a red card for me.”
"Clear head on head, it's a reckless action… So it's a red card" ?
Game Changing decisions. #RedRoses down to 14.#RWC2021 #NZLVSENG pic.twitter.com/V9prMAAZMH
— ITV Rugby (@ITVRugby) November 12, 2022
England, who had been 14-0 up, were then forced onto the backfoot, with the Black Ferns storming back into the game in the second-half to lead going into the final moments of the game.
When asked by Sky Sports what she thought of the impact the red card had on the game, former Red Rose Fleetwood said that England would ‘absolutely’ have won if not the for the dismissal.
“I’m pretty flat. Obviously, my friends are out there. They’re the ones taking the field. For them to go 60 minutes when down to 14, an incredible effort, it was phenomenal.”
“Absolutely,” said Fleetwood when asked would the Red Roses have won with 15 players. “To be able to go toe to toe for sixty minutes with a player down… if you’ve got that extra, yeah, definitely, I think England would have won by plenty.
ADVERTISEMENT
“Going into this game they showed what a force they were to reckon with 30 games on the bounce that they’ve won.
“It was their’s to lose and unfortunately losing Lydia so early on, that wasn’t meant to be England’s day today.”
Fleetwood also noted touched on the lost lineout in the final play of the game, observing that England would have won that lineout 99 times out of 100.
“To lose the way they did. Ninety-nine out of 100 times, England are scoring that in that last play. To lose that lineout in the last few seconds is going to be heartbreaking for them.”
ADVERTISEMENT
Rugby is not about mauling the ball for 80 minutes.
I could understand if it was pouring down with rain.
There’s 15 in a side, not 8 and it’s a team sport (Not the ferns fault you lost a player)
That’s how the black ferns won. By playing as a team, not separating the forwards and the backs.
No way. That Red card was well deserved, Portia Woodman missed 60 minutes of the final game through No fault of hers. It was a dangerous and high tackle. safety first. Portia is no slouch, she's the Top female try scorer in history, who knows how many tries she could've scored.
Not to mention the Fact that NZ missed how many conversations, the score would've been much bigger had she converted. It is what it is, NZ had a better attacking game and England had the maul and that's It..NZ deserved the win, period.
Her grief talking a load of nonsense.
Vicky Fleetwood may very well believe that England would have lifted the Rugby World Cup in Eden Park with ease if it weren’t for a first-half red card after just 18 minutes of the first half.
Well I have a belief that Porsha Woodman showed enough in her short time in the final to convince me that she would have scored a hat trick and that New Zealand would have won by plenty if she was allowed to play a full part in the game.
The fact that she was taken out of the game by a clear head on head collision ruined the game for those who had come expecting to see Woodman in full flight.
Is there anything to say that my belief is any less valid than Fleetwood's belief?
p.s. Hows the grape growing industry in England? Are they still all sour?
Some good comments here. Remember the 95 men’s WC. If not for Suzy playing with our food, the best team would have won that final too. Just saying. What I’m saying is shit happens. Get over it.
Another 4 years I suppose. The significant majority of England's tries at this world cup came from their rolling maul. Until an opposition team plays another style of game that only needs 30% of the ball and plays to its strengths. A rugby game is played by 15 players not 8. England had class players right across park they did not take advantage of it. But then again they came up against a tactical genius of the game in The Professor Wayne Smith...
The Red Roses do not play rugby, they play Rolling Maul (a form of legalised cheating). Fortunately for the game, the team that ran the ball and entertained the crowd won the game and the Cup. Go home and grow your game, not your muscles.
One defeat does not define a team. The Roses have done a huge amount for rugby in general and the women’s game in particular. The Ferns are beneficiaries of that along with the women’s game world wide. I’m saddened to hear people moaning about the red card. Davidson is one of our best refs across all formats of the game. Her justification for the card did not include that it was very late. In terms of strategy it is perfectly understandable that forward power especially in the women’s game will win you 30 games on the trot. The Ferns showed that firstly it can be done and secondly, witness the last lineout, it can go very pear-shaped. Will England learn anything from this disappointment. I hope so. But more importantly other countries will learn from both sides.
Gee. What a classless opinion piece.
Respect to England for fighting so well with 14 players.
Even bigger respect for to NZ for the win, especially after the English were getting a bit too cocky about their winning streak.
I'm glad the running game prevailed over the pushing game.
While England did out-muscle NZ, NZ out-ran & out-maneuvered England & it was a joy to watch.
NZ's brand of creative fast open play is way more exciting to see than England's 1-dimensional game of driving mauls.
ie - watching an attacking back line break the defense, sprint down field, passing the ball on the fly multiple times & diving over the line to score is way more entertaining than seeing a bunch of bodies in a slow motion push-of-war.
Not only did NZ win, they won in style.
Rubbish . they now know that winning Rugby can no longer have a gameplan based around train carriage pulling or snake pulling They where beaten by a side with speed and tactics and and strength even play England at their own game scoring twice so if England want to start again add discipline and invention into there game . not be one track minded .
The problem, then, is that England’s lack of discipline gave them the consequence of a Red Card. They lost because of their lack of discipline.
Yes, and took the record-holding Top Try Scorer of all World Cups out of the game! So Lydia Thompson was deservedly taken out of the game - and if she didn't make that tackle, Portia would have been GONE in another sense - blasting past the rest of the team into England's end zone!!
If there was a World Cup for lack of dignity in defeat, the English media would be champions for sure.
Remember how the Southern hemisphere teams have been pushing hard to allow a different player back on after 20 minutes.
But couldn't get teams like England to agree to the change....
"I think England would have won by plenty." But you didn't, did you?
England might have won if they had not 100% relied on the rolling mall to win the game. England could still have played some attacking rugby with 14 so that's not an excuse because NZ also had 14 for 10 minutes and all England tried to do was a another rolling mall. Any team that simply relies on the rolling mall deserves to lose - it is the most boring style of rugby on the planet. The English coaching team is to blame, they should have backed their players to play some attacking rugby.
NZ deserved to win for playing some decent attacking rugby with smiles on their faces.
Classy comments. How to take a loss on the chin.