Etzebeth fires backs at Bakkies Botha following criticism

30k is a really nice stadium size, but it does bring in the conundrum that it loses appeal when the club turns to hard times, and isn't as popular. So 25k might be a nice middle ground. Where a lot of NZ stadiums sit.

Passionate leader, aggressive defender, excellent kicker, zero running threat, can't draw defenders, constantly squanders attacking ball with speculative kicks because he can't run or draw defenders, has only ever performed in teams with dominant packs.

Actually, they would obviously have been capped given an opportunity earlier (where they were ineligible to for Ireland).

TTT, who was behind JGP at the Hurricanes, got three AB caps after a couple of further seasons acting as a backup SR player, once JGP left of course. In case you didn't see yourself contradicting your own comments above, JGP was just another player who became first choice for Ireland while 2nd (or even 3rd/outside the 23 in recent cases) for Leinster. And fair enough, no one is suggesting JGP would have surpassed TJP in three or four years either. He would have been an All Black though, and unlike in your Leinster example, similar performances from him would have seen TJP move on earlier to make way for him. Not limited him like he was in Ireland. That's just the advantage of the way they can only afford so many. Hell, one hit wonders like Seta Tamanivalu and Malakai Fekitoa got rocketed into the jersey at the time.

So not just him. Aki and Lowe both would have had opportunities, as you must know has been pointed out by now. It's true that the adversity of having to move to Ireland added a nice bit of mongrel to their game though, along with their typical development.

Aki looked comfortable as the main 12 in his first two seasons, he was fortunate SBW went back to league for a season you could say, but as a similar specialist he ultimate had to give the spot back again on his return. There's certainly no doubt he would have returned and flourished with coachs like Rennie, Wayne Smith, and Andrew Strawbridge, even Tom Coventry. All fair for him to take up an immediate contract instead of wait a year of course though.

It's just whatever the point of your comments are meant to make, your idea that these players wouldn't have achieved high honors in NZ is simply very shortsighted and simplistic. I can only think you are making incorrect conclusions about this topic because of this mistake. As a fan, Aki was looking to be the Nonu replacement for me, but instead the country had the likes of Laumape trying to fill those boots with him available. Ditto with Lowe once Rieko moved to center.

I'm actually surprised he's played 10 all his life, I had thought he had been used at 15 as a youngster too.

Occupied positions by Beauden on start team :

Fly-Half : 171 times ( Fly-Half 83% )

Fullback : 36 times ( Fullback 17% )

Interesting fact, he (shared with Aaron Cruden) and Handre Pollard had debut Rugby Championships against each other as starting 10s (BB had started at 15 already at that point I think). He was 23, Pollard just out of the u20WC, where he came up against and beat Mo'unga and Dmac. That was leading into the game against Wales.