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'He's not in the best 4 second rows': The Rugby Pod's shock AWJ Lions selection call

(Photo by David Rogers/Getty Images)

Ex-Scotland international second row Jim Hamilton has called on Lions boss Warren Gatland not to let his heart rule his head when it comes to considering Alun Wyn Jones for selection on next year’s Lions tour to South Africa.

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Gatland said last week that age was no barrier to tour selection even though Wales captain Jones, who last weekend became the world’s most-capped Test player of all time with 149 caps, will be 35 years and 308 days old when the first whistle sounds in next July’s Test series versus the Springboks, the current world champions.

However, after watching Jones fail to shine in Wales’ Six Nations defeat to Scotland last Saturday, Hamilton, an old second row rival of the Welsh skipper, believes that on current form the veteran does not deserve Lions selection.

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In the eyes of Hamilton, Maro Itoje, James Ryan, Scott Cummings and Jonny Hill all merit Lions selection ahead of Jones, who guided Wales to a derisory fifth-place finish in the delayed Six Nations after they struggled to adjust to Wayne Pivac’s new regime since he succeeded Gatland after the 2019 World Cup.

Speaking on the latest episode of The Rugby Pod, Hamilton said: “So Alun Wyn Jones, 149 caps, what is the thinking in Wales now, what is the thinking around the Lions? Is Alun Wyn Jones going to go on the Lions tour because he is Alun Wyn Jones or is Alun Wyn Jones going to go on the Lions tour because he is the best of four second rows?

“A lot of people say he is going to go on the Lions tour. In my opinion, he is not in the best four second rows. I’d say Jonny Hill is playing better than him. Scott Cummings from Scotland. Across the board in terms of where we stand now is Alun Wyn Jones in the top four second rows? Maro. James Ryan for Ireland: now he is not in the form he was but in my opinion he is still playing better than Alun Wyn Jones. And what is better? It’s carrying the ball, it’s defensively, it’s lineout.

“There is no doubt about it, Alun Wyn Jones is still a fantastic player. Like he absolutely is… but I have named four second rows there, Maro Itoje, James Ryan, Jonny Hill and Scott Cummings. Is Alun Wyn Jones the fifth or sixth? This is up for debate.

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“I know Alun Wyn Jones, you listen to him speak it’s not about amassing 150, 160 whatever caps he can potentially get to, but Wales are in transition. I’m not saying now is the time, it could be next year, but at what point do they say Alun Wyn Jones is going to need to make way because there needs to be an evolution for Wales and there needs to be a change of guard?

“Maybe it’s me because as a player there was no loyalty towards me… why is Alun Wyn Jones allowed to go on the Lions tour? Because he has been a phenomenal player. But if Alun Wyn Jones goes on the Lions tour he’s taking the place of a Scott Cummings or a Jonny Hill or someone who has never been on a Lions tour, or a Jonny Gray. It might be their only opportunity to go.”

Ex-England international Andy Goode, Hamilton’s show co-host, replied: “You have got to think about the coach, you have got to think about Warren Gatland, the experience that he has with Alun Wyn Jones, the detail that Alun Wyn Jones brings to his own performances, the homework he does off the field, the leadership.

“You are naming the top four second rows there now, you are naming Maro Itoje, James Ryan, Scott Cummings and Jonny Hill as the four best second rows in your opinion, Jim. You are taking three guys with limited experience. James Ryan has got a fair bit but Scott Cummings and Jonny Hill have got very limited international experience, so Alun Wyn Jones, if he is fit, if I had a mortgage, I’d put it on that he is going.”

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Hamilton responded: “I agree with you. He will go and I understand the reasons why… but it comes down to taking the best (form) players. Warren Gatland speaks about winners – Wales are fifth. I don’t want to be horrible but they are not the team they were for whatever reason.

“It comes down to the romance side of it. Does Jonny Hill expect to go on the Lions? No, he doesn’t. He wants to go but does he expect to go? No. Does he think Alun Wyn Jones will go in front of him? Of course he does, he is Alun Wyn Jones.

“I’m talking about the simple facts of ability and wanting to win games. If you put Jonny Hill into the team ahead of Alun Wyn Jones, are they [the Lions] going to beat South Africa? I don’t know because Alun Wyn Jones plays a certain style that arguably would be good against South Africa.

“But I’m just talking about the romance of the game and the loyalties that lie with some players that don’t lie with others. Maybe there is a part of me that I feel burnt by that situation.”

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J
JW 6 hours ago
Does South Africa have a future in European competition?

I rated Lowe well enough to be an AB. Remember we were picking the likes of George Bridge above such players so theres no disputing a lot of bad decisions have been made by those last two coaches. Does a team like the ABs need a finicky winger who you have to adapt and change a lot of your style with to get benefit from? No, not really. But he still would have been a basic improvement on players like even Savea at the tail of his career, Bridge, and could even have converted into the answer of replacing Beauden at the back. Instead we persisted with NMS, Naholo, Havili, Reece, all players we would have cared even less about losing and all because Rieko had Lowe's number 11 jersey nailed down.


He was of course only 23 when he decided to leave, it was back in the beggining of the period they had started retaining players (from 2018 onwards I think, they came out saying theyre going to be more aggressive at some point). So he might, all of them, only just missed out.


The main point that Ed made is that situations like Lowe's, Aki's, JGP's, aren't going to happen in future. That's a bit of a "NZ" only problem, because those players need to reach such a high standard to be chosen by the All Blacks, were as a country like Ireland wants them a lot earlier like that. This is basically the 'ready in 3 years' concept Ireland relied on, versus the '5 years and they've left' concept' were that player is now ready to be chosen by the All Blacks (given a contract to play Super, ala SBW, and hopefully Manu).


The 'mercenary' thing that will take longer to expire, and which I was referring to, is the grandparents rule. The new kids coming through now aren't going to have as many gp born overseas, so the amount of players that can leave with a prospect of International rugby offer are going to drop dramatically at some point. All these kiwi fellas playing for a PI, is going to stop sadly.


The new era problem that will replace those old concerns is now French and Japanese clubs (doing the same as NRL teams have done for decades by) picking kids out of school. The problem here is not so much a national identity one, than it is a farm system where 9 in 10 players are left with nothing. A stunted education and no support in a foreign country (well they'll get kicked out of those countries were they don't in Australia).


It's the same sort of situation were NZ would be the big guy, but there weren't many downsides with it. The only one I can think was brought up but a poster on this site, I can't recall who it was, but he seemed to know a lot of kids coming from the Islands weren't really given the capability to fly back home during school xms holidays etc. That is probably something that should be fixed by the union. Otherwise getting someone like Fakatava over here for his last year of school definitely results in NZ being able to pick the cherries off the top but it also allows that player to develop and be able to represent Tonga and under age and possibly even later in his career. Where as a kid being taken from NZ is arguably going to be worse off in every respect other than perhaps money. Not going to develop as a person, not going to develop as a player as much, so I have a lotof sympathy for NZs case that I don't include them in that group but I certainly see where you're coming from and it encourages other countries to think they can do the same while not realising they're making a much worse experience/situation.

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