Ireland and All Blacks to renew rivalry overseas again - report

Hopefully we will have a fair draw and an even schedule that does not continually benefit ‘favoured’ teams like New Zealand.

Well fingers crossed you get what you want re the draw and schedule and gives you that elusive semi-final. You will hopefully find some peace with that.

I will continue on with the winners deserve winning. Just so you know.

Rugby will cease to be uncompetitive when the entire RWC is designed to give the traditional powers an easy ride to the detriment of everyone else.

Can you point to other RWCs where 4 day turnarounds happened? I am curious as I dont believe it has. World Rugby tried to do it for 2015 only as far as I am aware and it didnt work, so it was not an inherent issue. You wont accept that rugby is a small niche sport with only a few countries taking it very seriously. I pointed this out before when I said there are not enough teams to do as you would like and keep it fair for all involved.

Uruguay had three of the top five in their group in 2015. That happens when you have 9 top teams trying to make 4 groups of 5. One group will be tougher, and will have a far lower ranked team. Whether the draw was done in the month before or 3 years before.

Next time it will be 24 teams in 6 groups of 4. Rugby is not competitive enough to do this. it needs to accept that, and so do fans like you.

You lamented Romania. They had 3 of the current top 5 ranked teams in the group.

If you don’t want seeding don’t bring up Romania. Proper seeding helps them.

You are defending a schedule where an up and coming team was forced to play two Tier1s within 4 days. The upset highlighted it. But it shouldn’t have taken a win to sort out this blatant farce. Rugby Teams cannot play two hard matches within 4 days and play well in the second match. I am sorry but you are talking through your backside with everything else.

Not sure where your first paragraph came from? To counter though in 2015 England, Wales and Australia were 3 of the top 5. England lost because they werent good enough. Move on.

Seeded draws are elitist. What caused the issue is the length of time leading into the tournament, and then the automatic grouping of A v B, C v D. That doesnt change that using rankings to decide who plays who is elitist.

I will say again that if Japan had of lost the SA game then nobody would remember the scheduling, that was my point by stating other teams had 4 or 5 day turnarounds. You are saying because they won (which is the biggest upset ever at a RWC) they should have had an easier schedule. It doesnt work like that. Japans target for that year was beat SA. They targeted a QF for 2019. They achieved both things.

Ofcourse having three of the top 5 in the same group and the top 5 on one side of the draw is a farce for a hole variety of reasons. I have never said otherwise. Proper seeding with the draw close to the tournament solves this but apparently this is elitist?

NZ can play their B team agaisnt Namibia. Japan can’t against Scotland. You know this.

Isn’t having a schedule that so blatantly hurts Tier2 teams elitist?

THe equivalent for a Tier1 in 2013 would be if Scotland had to play Ireland and then SA 4 days later. Do you see the issue now?

Ofcourse it is, thats why RWC changed it on the basis of the Japan experience.

The 42-10 Japan scoreline was not a reflection of Japan’s ability. It was a reflection of the unfair scheduling. Your argument is not based on any evidence. It is based on countering whatever I say. Do better.

Romania had to play Ireland then South Africa on consecutive weekends at the last world cup - where is your big self righteous argument saying that was unfair? playing two of the top 4 when you’re barely in the top 20.

Just because certain fixtures or events can back up your argument doesn’t make it fact.

If Japan hadnt beaten South Africa this wouldnt even be an issue. So your moral outrage is easily dismissed. New Zealand played Argentina and then Namibia on the 20th and 24th of September in the tournament. Wheres the reference to that? Thats 4 days too. Or does it only apply when it suits you.

Are you actually saying that Japan having to play a match 4 days after beating SA was fair match shceduling. Are you serious? Your proving that you are a contrarian!

There are many aspects to what determines who wins a match. Dodgy draws and Scheduling should not be one of them. Please think again on your argument re Japan in 2015.

Wales havent beaten New Zealand since 1953. its a guarantee they would have done it in the final? Sure.

There are not 12+ teams at a high level in rugby to do what you are suggesting. So you are not living in the real world, with clear thought out concepts. There just arent. it would be great if there were, but because there is only 8 or 9 really good competitive teams it means having 4 groups is going to create one or possibly two tough groups, with other easier groups. Thats a fact.

My suggestion of having the QF draw after the group stage is fair to all who progress. You yourself said that Ireland and France were so determined to avoid playing NZ in 2015 that Ireland played such a physical style of rugby that they injured three of their own players and had another banned. They punched themselves out.

Also in 2015, Scotland beat Samoa winning 33-30 or 36-33, something like that. If Samoa had won, Japan would have gone through. Losing to Scotland did not eliminate them. SA, Scotland and Japan all won 3 games.

Ireland and France upcoming teams? Ireland had won the previous two Six Nations and France have a two tier domestic professional league set-up. Upcoming teams.

My argument, again for you, is that a countries player management and squad rotation is more important than the draw. if you are going to pick your first team for every pool match, you cant expect to have them fresh for the knock-outs. Thats my argument to your draw and schedule are to blame talk. I have consistently said the same thing.

You haven’t a clue. Wales played with 14 men for almost the entire match against France in the semi final, were still the better team and lost only by a single point. I watched the match. Ireland played well. We couldn’t repel Warren Ball. NZ wouldn’t have been able to in the final either given their performance against a weak Frence team. That Welsh team were Grand Slam champions within 6 months and won the 6 nations the following year. Top team.

You are using the strawman that I am suggesting top teams play NO HARD before a QF. I never said that. I said that either top teams in ALL pools (seeds 1-3) play one of the big pool matches on the FINAL WEEKEND before the QF, or NONE of them play a big match that weekend. This would have helped Tier2 teams as for example it would have meant that Chile did not have their rest week before the QF when itw as no use to them.

Injuries happen in any game, but injuries take time to heal. If you are playing your front line players in a major match a week a week before a QF then most injuroes will not heal in time. You are also looking at fatigue (to front line players after a major match) and soft tissue damage. Again if ALLmajor teams are given this slot, fine. Otherwise, none of them.

Scheduling Japan to play Scotland 4 days after beating SA eliminated Japan. That was elitist. Forcing two upcoming teams France-Ireland to face off 6 days before a rested NZ-Argentina was also disgraceful.

I dont think youre argument is genuine now. It has changed so many times it can’t have much integrity left.

Getting personal again with your replies. Interesting. Seeding systems are elitist - they are set up so the top teams or players avoid each other in early rounds and meet at the latter stages. Creating a hierarchy and a class system.

You’re being disingenuous with your support for Wales. Covering Irelands failed performance that day and pretending they were a great team. That tournament/ QF win launched them to the next two six nations, but they werent contenders coming into the tournament.

Yes i would have no problem with having top seeds in a group. I would prefer a more FA Cup style random draw in most tournaments. Think it could allow for non-fancied teams to get further which would hopefully create interest internally/ nationally for that team that can be built on for sustained success in the future.

Your idea of how the fixtures should work is elitist. No top seed should play a tough game before the QF to keep them fresh and hopefully avoid injury and reduce fatigue - isnt that your suggestion? How does it create an opportunity for the lower teams to succeed? Also an injury can happen in any match. Dupont broke his nose when France beat Namibia last year. I did Google that because i couldnt remember if it was Uruguay or not. Just for clarities sake.

You do realise that if group A had played C in the last tournament, and B played D, then none of this would be a problem. The randomly given allocation of the groups did not cause the issue, its that A always plays B and C plays D. I would agree with changing that, but thats it. Have the knock-outs decided once the final group games are done. Thats my suggestion to improve the tournament.

Seeded implies TOP SEEDS in this conversation dont be disingenuous.

Are you really this stupid? Are you saying the seeding system is elitist?

There is a seeding system in every major sport is based on merit. Are you saying that the top 5 could potentially be in the same pool in a world cup qualifier without seedings?

If you are progessing between RWCs the seeding reqrds you. It is the oppositie of elitist.

There is one team in World Rugby who doesn’t have to play tough matches before a QF. That is NZ. Last 3 world cups always play the tough match on match they 1 and then thry focus on the QF/Knock outs. It is utterly elitist now.

The draw made 3 years before a world cup was utterly elitist. It ensured that any team improving to challenge the old guard were landed in tough groups. Fracical.

In the current system no 4/5 seeds have made the QF, ever.

Seeds 1-3 fill the QF places. Chile had their rest week in the last weekend before the QFs which was utterly ridiculous and flagged. Having the TV focus for the last weekend on the best Tier2 Vs Tier1 clashes is what helps Tier2s. There should have been a global audience for Fiji v Portugal last year.

Wales should have been playing NZ in the final in 2011 and were actually a better team at that point. If that is a suprise to you you know nothing anout rugby. Ireland played decent in the QF and kept it tight against a top contender. No shame in that. I hoped Wales would win after. Great team.

Look what up? You’re lying.

Go look it up you nut.

Didnt have to google it. Knew those players were there. Everyone knows Wales had a youthful feel to them then and it was a passing of the guard from Martyn Williams, Stephen Jones and Shane Williams. Common knowledge for fans.

All teams are seeded arent they? Do you mean the top 4 teams shouldn’t have to play ‘tough’ matches before a QF? Dont agree, also dont want that to happen. Would make a boring tournament that way with no jeopardy at that stage. Very little chance of upsets at a competition that is already too predictable. What rugby needs is more teams in with a position to succeed, not ring-fencing the top teams to guarantee them a place. Thats down to the individual nation to improve though, and not something that is down to the world cup. What you are suggesting sounds elitest to me.

What Bundee said? Are you assholes dredging up old sh1t to try and substantiate your lies about Ireland being arrogant?

The Rugby world dislikes truly arrogant nations..the ones who list their RWC achievements to demean others, or others their 100 year record, insulting beaten opponents and teams…..know any teams like that?

Wales were the best team left in the tournament at the SF stage in 2011. Googling the team sheet and reproducing it here means nothing.

Again either ALL seeded teams play a major match the week before the QF or NONE. Can you address this please without deflection by attacking Irelands record. If you believe this IS a level playing field then explain why?

Not hiding anything. You keep making assumptions without politely asking where I am from.

In 2011 the Welsh team that beat Ireland had a lot of players starting out on their careers such as Preistland, J Davies, Lydiate, Faletau, Warburton. Halfpenny and North were still very young and starters. AWJ was not yet the player he became for leadership and effectiveness. Talented? Yes. Succesful? They were. But green? Also a fair comment. Ireland were the favourites in that QF. Wales were the surprise package in the tournament. They are fair comments. Thats a trait from me.

You are very funny for your attempted little barbs. Keep them coming. I suppose it helps you.

To sum up my opinion though as this is a rugby forum. ireland have had a variety of group opponents, from tough last year to the easier groups in 2019 and 2011. A variety of schedules too. And lost each time at a QF. Its not the draw or the schedule. its the irish system that aims for - and achieves, I will give credit where it is due - success at European and Six Nations level, but not world cups. They should have done better at some point.

Either ALL seeded teams are scheduled to play a major match the week before the QF or none.

Thats an even playing field and reasonable to expect in a major tournament.

If you think the Welsh team in 2011 were ‘Green’ then you are either ignorant or understand nothing about rugby.

You seem to be making Insults about Ireland while hiding your own nationality. A little cowardly, but maybe a trait.

There was not an even playing field in France. If the scheduling issues had been against NZ (you’ve admitted) they get hammered out the door. Games should be decided on merit not on how benefits from scheduling fuck ups.

Either ALL high seeded teams are scheduled to plays a major match the week before the QF, or none are. That’s an even playing field. What are you afraid of?

Jog on bro. Go see what Bundee said after his man of match award in the WC.

Guys like YOU make people dislike Ireland as a rugby nation.

Not South African either. Try again. You clearly care getting so riled up.

There have been 10 RWC. In 2019 Ireland were ranked no. 1, had the easiest group ever and lost to Japan, then lost the QF. In 2011 were beaten by a very green Wales team with players like ODriscoll, OGara, O`Connell etc. 2007 was a colossal joke for the IRFU.

The only consistent thing has been poor performances. Your temper tantrums and faux moral outrage aren't covering for that.

They don’t hand out wins for probably, if only, or should haves.

The All Blacks didn’t find a way to win in the Irish series because they weren’t good enough.

They were in the return match, which you’re still in mourning over.

I get it dude, you’re grieving. No need for insults though. It’s not like I cupped my hand behind my ear.

In other words you would have got hammered out the gates, thanks. Probably a 20 point win. Why didn’t you ‘find a way’ in the Ireland tour to NZ. Utter bollocks youre talking. Humble Hero shit. The Great ABs, find a way. Superstars. France beat you by 14 points and they played badly. You were plenty behind the top 3 in that world cup. Remove the dodgy Draw and scheduling and the easy semi final is the one with NZ in it.

If you are a sporting nation then you should insist on a level playing field.

Whether thats Japan, Ireland and France in 2015. Or Ireland, Scotland and Chile in 2023.

Its a scheduling issue that benefits some and disadvantages others and if NZ ‘find a way’ they shouldn’t need unfair advantages to do so. Hilarious though! Thanks for the laughs!

Its amazing how NZ are so great, yet so humble!

Scotland were ranked 5th in the world you fool. No one cares about your disrespect for them. France and Ireland were similarly drawn to play eachother in 2015 the week before facing NZ/Arg. What was your solution for that achedule Farce? Send on the B team against France. Stop being ridiculous.

The RWC schedule should not disadvantage teams unnessarily. The solution is to change the scheduling system to remove the disadvantage. End of.

Try arguing with integrity instead of defending an archaic shceduling system that benefits a few and disadvantages everyone else.

Can you also build your own arguments isntead of rehashing unproven ‘theorys’ from idiotic SA media (I am guessing). FFS

THe world cup had a dodgy draw and dodgy scheduling which SA benefitted from. Lets have an even playing field and see.

Ireland stats V SA in RWCs = 100% win ratio.

2023/2024 results.

Ireland 2 SA 1

Matches in Paris, Pretoria, and Durban.

Ireland are better. Soz.

“You have to prepare for a de facto knock out test aginst Scotland a week before France, you are losing against France”. No opinion on this one?

Answer the question you coward. You are allowed answer hyptheticals unless you are a moron. Does it make it harder or not to beat France?

We know teh answer is ‘Yes!’. You’re too much of a coward to be honest

Eben was the one who said that. He lied about the Irish. Now you are lying. Eben looked very sheepish in the SA series when he had to face the men he lied about. Face covered in blood match two, about 4 times, good enough for that lying scvm.

Can’t answer that. Never happend,but i’ll back my team & country. Not look for excuses.

On that matter why don’t you mention Ireland had the off before the Scotland test?

Schedule don’t matter much. Gotta beat the best if you wanna be World Champs. Simple as.

“You have to prepare for a de facto knock out test aginst Scotland a week before France, you are losing against France”. No opinion on this one?

The fact of the matter is that the schedule is a joke and favours some teams and not others. SA or NZ will never have to play a big knock out match the week after a big pool match. Ireland, France and Scotland will. I think these early RWCs in time will be viewed with the seriousness that the early football WCs with those funny draws and schedules.

Lets have an even playing field and see who can win eh?

You beat what’s put infront of you. IRE disregarded NZ before the QF. Sayin to Eben - sure wel’ll see you in the final.

Fact of the matter is- You could’nt beat NZ when it counted. If we aren’t that good why do you rate your own team so high???

Well counter it with argument if youre able?? Its a fact. You have to prepare for a de facto knock out test aginst Scotland a week before France, you are losing against France. You are not that good. Durban proved that.