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'It's not Foley's fault': Ex-All Black comes in to bat for Wallaby flyhalf

Nic White and referee Mathieu Raynal, Wallabies v New Zealand September 15, 2022 in Melbourne, Australia (Photo by Morgan Hancock/Getty Images)

Former All Black wing John Kirwan has come to the defence of Wallabies flyhalf Bernard Foley after his late game stalling cost his side possession in the dying stages of the first Bledisloe test.

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Speaking on Sky Sport NZ’s The Breakdown, Kirwan was perplexed at the timing of the call but said that Mathieu Raynal had every right to make it.

The issue of time wasting in general was raised as an area that needs to be tackled by the game’s administrators as it has crept into the modern game at the highest level.

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“It’s actually not Foley’s fault, it’s not Raynal’s fault,” Kirwan explained to The Breakdown panel.

“Everyone is time wasting around the world in test match rugby.

“Either props are going down or the game’s being slowed up, encroaching [the gap] at the lineout.

“I’ve just never seen it enforced before.

“So was the referee right? Yes. Was the decision wrong? If you are a New Zealander, no, if you are Australian, yes.

“The trouble is we can’t leave stuff like time wasting up to interpretation.

“The ref was right but no one has seen that rule for a 150 million years.

“I’ve seen it once in my career and it was for a shot at goal. But we’ve got to start thinking about time wasting as a whole and how do we change that.”

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Jeff Wilson put the onus on World Rugby to decide what kind of game they want to see at the showpiece event next year as frustrations grow around the product that many fans feel is over-officiated.

The ex-All Black admitted that the call against Foley ‘wasn’t appropriate’ in the circumstances where it played a heavy influence on the outcome of the game.

“He had every right to make that decision, I think that in this case it wasn’t appropriate,” Wilson said.

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“It may have been the wrong time to make this call. I think this is the opportunity, and we haven’t heard from World Rugby, surprise, surprise, they look at what they want their game to be in 12 months time, at the Rugby World Cup.

“What do they want at the international level? Manipulating the amount of time of ball of play based on what the score is, whether you are down to 14 men, being a bit fatigued so you sit a prop down, all areas that clearly frustrate fans.

“That’s up to World Rugby to decide, the type of rugby they want international rugby to be.”

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Comments

11 Comments
d
dermot 778 days ago

Refs dont control crooked scrums ,front rows crabbing ,crooked lineouts but a number 10 doesnt hear right and the laws must be protected at all costs. Either train better referees or put the tmos in charge and divide up the pitch with on field assistants anf a specialist fowards ref but stop pretending that world rugby refs are doing anything but a crap job .

S
Sam 778 days ago

Nope, Foley is completely at fault.
If time is stopped for deliberate time wasting, you don't deliberately waste more when it comes back on.

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Luwe 778 days ago

Just because the law hasn't been applied in the past doesn't mean it can't be applied now.

It means it must be applied now moving forward to the world cup.

The law has nothing to do with part time business as that where we create cry babies.

M
Michael 778 days ago

Commentators like Kirwan should know better and actually read the LAW book . I remember when he was a player he did some dirty tactics too ! No OZZY your 10 cost you the game - over 40 seconds of being told to kick it including the Ref calling time out to be triple clear telling the 10 he must play on and he still didnt kick it out with his team mates screaming at him to do so. So who is the real flog, Ozzy blew it and NZ took their opportunity. The Ref could not be more clearer. Tim Horan is a flogger. The whole commentary team need to study the LAW book and get real with their cowboy antics. No wonder Referees are hard to find. The Ref had just officated over one of the best NZ OZZY games for years. Postives everywhere. Over 75 points scroed and it went down to the wire. Which meant the referee kept the game open for 80 minutes a s much as the players mistakes would let him - WELL DONE RAYNAL THE REF OF THE CHAMPIONSHIP - OTHER Postives in OZZYS FAVOUR. The Ref should have checked OZZY Kellaways try forward pass and didnt whilst the 10 quickly kicked the conversion 3x as fast to avoid a review of the pass. The OZZY lock should have got a red card for deliberately & ilegally attacking the knee of the player caught in a ruck.

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Willie 778 days ago

And let's not forget the amount of time wasted by today's refs playing advantage for far too long.
Dead time and one reason I will no longer pay to attend games.

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Silk 778 days ago

I agree with all the comments made in this article. Something has to be done about time wasting. My Bok team are the biggest culprits.
Back to the insident on Saturday, I feel the ref didn't use common sense. He was right but...
He didn't call for time wasting at many times earlier in the match.
To call out Foley at that time was stupendous.
That call influenced the outcome of the Bledisloe and the Rugby Championship. That is Big.
Foley was also wrong. Kick the ball out man. His forwards can then able up to the lineout, like the Boks do. Win the line out, maul until time is up and kick it into the stand.
This was a massive call at a crucial time in a big match and all parties involved screwed up.
By the way it was an incredible test match to watch here from South Africa.

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Flankly 1 hour ago
'Absolute madness': Clive Woodward rips into Borthwick in wake of NZ loss

Borthwick is supposed to be the archetypical conservative coach, the guy that might not deliver a sparkling, high-risk attacking style, but whose teams execute the basics flawlessly. And that's OK, because it can be really hard to beat teams that are rock solid and consistent in the rugby equivalent of "blocking and tackling".


But this is why the performance against NZ is hard to defend. You can forgive a conservative, back-to-basics team for failing to score tons of tries, because teams like that make up for it with reliability in the simple things. They can defend well, apply territorial pressure, win the set piece battles, and take their scoring chances with metronomic goal kicking, maul tries and pick-and-go goal line attacks.


The reason why the English rugby administrators should be on high alert is not that the English team looked unable to score tries, but that they were repeatedly unable to close out a game by executing basic, coachable skills. Regardless of how they got to the point of being in control of their destiny, they did get to that point. All that was needed was to be world class at things that require more training than talent. But that training was apparently missing, and the finger has to point at the coach.


Borthwick has been in the job for nearly two years, a period that includes two 6N programs and an RWC campaign. So where are the solid foundations that he has been building?

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N
Nickers 1 hour ago
Scott Robertson responds to criticism over All Blacks' handling errors

Very poor understanding of what's going on and 0 ability to read. When I say playing behind the gain line you take this to mean all off-loads and site times we are playing in front of the gain line???


Every time we play a lot of rugby behind the gain line (for clarity, meaning trying to build an attack and use width without front foot ball 5m+ behind the most recent breakdown) we go backwards and turn the ball over in some way. Every time a player is tackled behind the most recent breakdown you need more and more people to clear out because your forwards have to go back around the corner, whereas opposition players can keep moving forward. Eventually you run out of either players to clear out or players to pass to and the result in a big net loss of territory and often a turnover. You may have witnessed that 20+ times in the game against England. This is a particularly dumb idea inside your own 40m which is where, for some reason, we are most likely to employ it.


The very best ABs teams never built an identity around attacking from poor positions. The DC era team was known for being the team that kicked the most. To engineer field position and apply pressure, and create broken play to counter attack. This current team is not differentiating between when a defence has lost it's structure and there are opportunities, and when they are completely set and there is nothing on. The reason they are going for 30 minute + periods in every game without scoring a single point, even against Japan and a poor Australian team, is because they are playing most of their rugby on the back foot in the wrong half.

43 Go to comments
N
Nickers 1 hour ago
Scott Robertson responds to criticism over All Blacks' handling errors

I thought we made a lot of progress against that type of defence by the WC last year. Lots of direct running and punching holes rather than using width. Against that type of defence I think you have to be looking to kick on first phase when you have front foot ball which we did relatively successfully. We are playing a lot of rugby behind the gain line at the moment. They are looking for those little interchanges for soft shoulders and fast ball or off loads but it regularly turns into them battering away with slow ball and going backwards, then putting in a very rushed kick under huge pressure.


JB brought that dimension when he first moved into 12 a couple of years ago but he's definitely not been at his best this year. I don't know if it is because he is being asked to play a narrow role, or carrying a niggle or two, but he does not look confident to me. He had that clean break on the weekend and stood there like he was a prop who found himself in open space and didn't know what to do with the ball. He is still a good first phase ball carrier though, they use him a lot off the line out to set up fast clean ball, but I don't think anyone is particularly clear on what they are supposed to do at that point. He was used really successfully as a second playmaker last year but I don't think he's been at that role once this year. He is a triple threat player but playing a very 1 dimensional role at the moment. He and Reiko have been absolutely rock solid on defence which is why I don't think there will be too much experimentation or changes there.

43 Go to comments
LONG READ
LONG READ England need to face a few home truths if they are to relearn that winning habit England need to face a few home truths if they are to relearn that winning habit
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