1
‘Not even the best halfback’: Kiwi dismisses Antoine Dupont GOAT talk
By Finn Morton
New Zealand sports commentator Tony Johnson has dismissed the popular debate that Antoine Dupont is the greatest rugby player of all time by arguing the point that the Frenchman isn’t “even the best halfback” the world has ever seen.
ADVERTISEMENT
Dupont etched his name into rugby folklore last weekend with a Player of the Match performance in the gold medal match at the Paris Olympic Games. The 27-year-old scored two tries and set up another to lead France to a 28-7 win over Fiji at Stade de France.
That was the latest in a long string of mesmerising and historic performances from the former World Rugby 15s Player of the Year. This year alone, Dupont has led Toulouse to Champions Cup and Top 14 titles, and also France to championship glory on the SVNS Series.
What Dupont has been able to do in both 15s and sevens this year is nothing short of legendary. Others including Bryan Habana, Ardie Savea and Michael Hooper have tried to bring their respective skillsets to sevens but have ultimately fallen short of greatness.
Fans and some pundits have suggested that Dupont is now the ‘GOAT’ in rugby union after winning that gold medal at the Paris Games. They would suggest that Dupont has eclipsed the likes of Dan Carter, Johnny Wilkinson and the late Jonah Lomu.
But Sky Sport commentator Tony Johnson has strongly hit back at those claims by comparing Dupont to what Carter was able do with the All Blacks in their run to glory at the 2015 Rugby World Cup, and what former Wales halfback Gareth Edwards achieved with the Lions.
“Dupont’s not even the best halfback of all-time, let alone the greatest player,” the well-known New Zealand rugby commentator said on SENZ’s Afternoons with Staffy.
ADVERTISEMENT
“He’s a hell of a player. You could put up an argument that right now he is the best player in the world – Ardie Savea fans might see differently, but on current form, what he’s done, what he’s achieved.
“He hasn’t won a World Cup, hasn’t won a match in the southern hemisphere. Yeah, he’s won a few Six Nations and yeah, he’s a hell of a good player, but the teams that they had, he was the leading light in… quite differently the best World Cup team, or team that France have ever had, in terms of being equipped to win a World Cup and what happened to them?
“Yes, he influences matches but could he influence a game in the way that Dan Carter influenced the All Blacks?
“In terms of the halfback, Gareth Edwards played in two (British and Irish) Lions teams that won in the southern hemisphere for the first time.
ADVERTISEMENT
“I just think it’s one of those arguments that people either get a bit too excited in the moment or they just put it out there because they know it’s going to create a debate and lots of clicks.”
But that doesn’t take away from Dupont’s greatness. What the Frenchman has achieved in rugby at just 27 years of age is incredible, and he hopefully still has a long career ahead of him at least in the 15s format.
By leading France to Paris Olympics glory, Dupont has achieved something that almost transcends sport. The Les Bleus 15s captain was an icon and hero for many during last year’s Rugby World Cup and that’s carried through to Olympics glory.
As reported by RugbyPass’ Josh Raisey a couple of days ago, fans packed the stands at Trocadero Gardens at the foot of the Eiffel Tower as the French sevens players paraded their medals at Champions Park on Monday.
“This is unheard of. For rugby sevens, it’s a superb showcase. The atmosphere was crazy. It’s incredible and super powerful,” coach Jerome Daret said, as translated by Google.
“We went looking for gold in Los Angeles, we found the vein and we exploited it in Madrid with the title of world champion and now that of Olympic champion. It’s awesome and powerful!
“I have difficulty understanding everything that has happened since the final whistle. The players were incredible. The staff also who created a crazy journey, relying on very high-quality consultants.
“It’s a whole package to perform and everything has been beneficial. It’s a war machine.”
he is not the greatest but has done well blanco and other french players would proberly have been great sevens players. sure he wona gold medal with the french sevens team this year well if sevens had been in the olympics when christon culllen and jonah were playing sevens they proberly would have won gold as well
Truth bombs hurt
Don't know much about Tony Johnson but Antoine Dupont has a Gold Medal from taking part in the Olympics that happens 1s every 4 years. Only the best participate in these and the greatest win Gold.
If you can't win or even participate in an Olympics event at the very least Please respect Gold Medalists.
Where's his world cup gold medal cool fijians have 3 gold medals so are they the greatest now
He’s got a golden medal from olympic 7s, which - last time I checked - was a different sport than rugby union.
Maybe he’s the best ever 7s player, that’s not the debate I want to take part in, as I don’t care about 7s.
But for him to be even considered in the GOAT debate, he’d have to not only win the RWC, but be absolutely instrumental in that.
There are some 40+ guys who have won two RWC’s. Any one of them should be considered before Dupont is.
McCaw, or Carter have won back-to-back RWCs, and have 88+% international win-loss ratio. Dupont can’t even see their backs on the horizon. I don’t see how anyone could conjure an argument, that Dupont is better than those two.
Wilkinson could do anything Dupont does, and then some, and he’s won the RWC. England were NEVER winning that Cup without him.
This is such a silly debate, I’m lost for words. It’s driven by fanboy children stricken with severe recency bias. The grown-ups in the room can just shake their heads in disbelief at the inanity of the suggestion.
Dupont is one RWC gold (and a massive performance in achieving it) away from even being in consideration. There is NO WAY a player from a top Tier1 country can ever be considered GOAT without the silverware.
If and when he wins it, he’ll be automatically in the debate. But first he needs to beat the best to be the best.
So does that make the USA the greatest team ever for winning gold in XVs in 1924?
Ignorant SH "pundits" spouting absolute ignorant 💩 yet again.
Just another day in the shagging of sheep land.
No Wonder how SH supporters are so utterly thick.
What an articulate contribution.
Antoine Dupont has consistently been one of the three best rugby players in the world for the last three years (together with Ardie Savea, and Eben Etzebeth).
That being said, the debate about Dupont being the GOAT rugby player is completely out of place.
Of course, it's anyone's opinion, but no one should be considered GOAT on their club level performances, or performances in another sport (Sevens).
In my view, it's the highest level international competition, that builds GOAT legacy. And it's utterly mad to consider a player, who's never won the best of the best competition (RWC) the goat, when we've had some 48 players in history to have won it TWICE.
IMHO, to be even considered among the best, you have to not only beat the best (RWC), but you have to be an essential and indispensable contributor to that victory. It's that simple. Hic Rhodos, hic salta. Dupont hasn't won the RWC yet, what's worse, not only he wasn't even close to being the best player at the 2023 RWC, he wasn't even the best French player at the tournament (that was Mauvaka, hands down, by some distance ahead of Penaud), and yes, that includes Dupont pre-facial injury.
In my view, Thierry Dusautoir has thousand times better claim for GOAT, than Dupont. 2010-2015 All Blacks were the best rugby team (starting XV) ever assembled. Dusautoir's France played them in the 2011 RWC finals in New Zealand, and even though France narrowly lost, Dusautoir was the best player on the field by a country mile. France lost IN SPITE of Dusautoir's performance. He scored his team's only try and made like seventeen million tackles in what was likely the best individual performance in the history of rugby. TD played the best team ever at the best team's home turf and was the best guy on the pitch. THIS is how legacies are made: you perform your very best against the very best, instead of butchering minnows and then shrinking when push comes to shove.
I'm not claiming, that TD is the GOAT, just that he's got much better case to be made for him, than Dupont has. And Dupont can't be excused by the George Best effect the way say Sergio Parisse could. France have been one of the strongest rugby teams all through history, and any French guy who wants to claim the GOAT status simply must have won the RWC gold. It's actually remarkable, that they haven't won it yet.
This debate is utterly ridiculous, and the intensity with which the Dupont-GOAT is being crammed down our throats by all the media reeks of only one allowed official canonical truth. It's also a silly example of recency bias. I recall, at around RWC 2023 there were similar talks about Sexton, about him being the best Irish player of all time. In ten year's time, the dust would have settled, everyone would have come back to their senses and realized, that BOD >> Sexton. And the same thing will happen for Dupont, because there will be another shiny new star, and without the RWC gold, it doesn't matter how many ECCs, Top14s, or Six Nations a player has won, because no one will remember ten years on.
Carry your team to the RWC gold, Antoine, and you'll definitely enter the debate. Without it: simply no chance.
That was a good read tbh
Good on Tony Johnson for bringing some sanity to this discussion.