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'We'll get the tag again': Ex-Bok coach's warning after dirty off-the-ball play against Pumas

Marvin Orie of South Africa celebrates after winning a test match between Argentina Pumas and South Africa Springboks at Jose Amalfitani Stadium on August 5, 2023 in Buenos Aires, Argentina. (Photo by Marcelo Endelli/Getty Images)

Ex-Springbok assistant coach Swys de Bruin has warned the Springboks not to carry on like they did in Buenos Aires against the Pumas or risk getting the ‘tag’ again from match officials.

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South Africa’s discipline has come under the spotlight after conceding 13 penalties and a yellow card, but it was the off-the-ball antics that the former coach did not like.

Particularly in the first half where Argentina were able to build a 10-3 halftime lead, South Africa’s discipline played a helping hand in giving the home side the advantage.

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De Bruin feared that it could impact their chances at the World Cup with the stigma around being a dirty side sticking with them.

“How was our discipline? It was small little things. Marvin Orie, I coached him, bloody great player but stop doing this stuff,” de Bruin explained on SuperSport TV’s The Final Whistle show.

“Have a look, if this is going to happen in a World Cup we are going to get the ‘tag’ again.”

In the first half lock Marvin Orie and scrumhalf Cobus Reinach got into a scuffle with Pumas winger Emiliano Boffelli that spilled over the sideline.

Boffelli was trapped at the bottom of a ruck underneath a pile of bodies before Orie decided to give him the facial treatment.

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Reinach dropped the knee into his rib area while trying to fetch the ball before hauling him out of the ruck underneath his armpit.

The Argentinian was clearly unhappy, springing to his feet to confront the Springboks No 9 who was shoved unapologetically towards the advertising boards.

“No need to do whatever happens there, you’ll see Marvin will come in right in front of the AR [assistant referee], he’s putting his hand on the guy’s face on the ground, on his head,” de Bruin said.

“Remember the moustache tickling with Nic White? You don’t touch in the face. It’s out.

“Now Rienach, I don’t know what he does… he pulls him almost into the AR… now that is causing chaos. Guys leave it.

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“Jacques [Nienaber] and the guys, you’ve got to sort this out.”

Another clip showed Pumas flyhalf Nico Sanchez hit extremely late in the back after the pass by openside flanker Franco Mostert on a set-piece launch.

Sanchez was left reeling by the ‘dog shot’ which nailed him in the ribs, leaving the referee no option but to issue a yellow card.

“The ball is passed, there is a double tackle without the ball,” Bruin said.

“We will be in big trouble if we do this, look at that No 10 he gets one in the ribs there.

“It’s unnecessary. There is a fine line between being aggressive and bad discipline. You can be very hard, you can be very tough, but that’s not it.”

Head-to-Head

Last 4 Meetings

Wins
4
Draws
0
Wins
0
Average Points scored
27
13
First try wins
100%
Home team wins
25%

After Mostert’s yellow at the very next lineout, Orie was once again caught out with dangerous play taking a jumper out in the air leading to another penalty.

“We’d just had a yellow, we are under the pump and now suddenly Marvin plays him in the air taking his legs out,” he said.

“Not good enough. If we can sort this out, it will be another step in the right direction I think.”

Former head coach Nic Mallett defended some of the critique around the high line defence which has a difficult job to do.

He said at times players will be tackled without the ball due to the speed at which the line is coming forward and the desire to pin the opposition behind the gain line.

“It really is the way we play,” Mallett said of the rush defence.

“We get up for games and we want to knock people back. We want to knock them back a long way behind the advantage line.

“When we ball carry, we try and get over them and get a long way across the advantage line.

“So it’s really hard against teams that take it flat to the line, and I immediately cite Ireland, who come with two or three options, the pullback pass or the guy flat, or the guy himself.

“And they are right in your face. The three runners at you, at the last moment you don’t know whether the ball is going to be passed or not.

“You can’t pull out of the tackle. It’s very good attack, but we are criticising our defence.

“I think it is very, very tough. You’ve got to be watching that ball but also watching that runner, and you don’t want him to get past the advantage line.

“So there are going to be situations when we play against teams that attack on the gain line.”

 

 

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J
JW 3 hours ago
'Passionate reunion of France and New Zealand shows Fabien Galthie is wrong to rest his stars'

Ok, managed to read the full article..

... New Zealand’s has only 14 and the professional season is all over within four months. In France, club governance is the responsibility of an independent organisation [the Ligue Nationale de Rugby or LNR] which is entirely separate from the host union [the Fédération Française de Rugby or FFR]. Down south New Zealand Rugby runs the provincial and the national game.

That is the National Provincial Championship, a competition of 14 representative union based teams run through the SH international window and only semi professional (paid only during it's running). It is run by NZR and goes for two and a half months.


Super Rugby is a competition involving 12 fully professional teams, of which 5 are of New Zealand eligibility, and another joint administered team of Pacific Island eligibility, with NZR involvement. It was a 18 week competition this year, so involved (randomly chosen I believe) extra return fixtures (2 or 3 home and away derbys), and is run by Super Rugby Pacific's own independent Board (or organisation). The teams may or may not be independently run and owned (note, this does not necessarily mean what you think of as 'privately owned').


LNR was setup by FFR and the French Government to administer the professional game in France. In New Zealand, the Players Association and Super Rugby franchises agreed last month to not setup their own governance structure for professional rugby and re-aligned themselves with New Zealand Rugby. They had been proposing to do something like the English model, I'm not sure how closely that would have been aligned to the French system but it did not sound like it would have French union executive representation on it like the LNR does.

In the shaky isles the professional pyramid tapers to a point with the almighty All Blacks. In France the feeling for country is no more important than the sense of fierce local identity spawned at myriad clubs concentrated in the southwest. Progress is achieved by a nonchalant shrug and the wide sweep of nuanced negotiation, rather than driven from the top by a single intense focus.

Yes, it is pretty much a 'representative' selection system at every level, but these union's are having to fight for their existence against the regime that is NZR, and are currently going through their own battle, just as France has recently as I understand it. A single focus, ala the French game, might not be the best outcome for rugby as a whole.


For pure theatre, it is a wonderful article so far. I prefer 'Ntamack New Zealand 2022' though.

The young Crusader still struggles to solve the puzzle posed by the shorter, more compact tight-heads at this level but he had no problem at all with Colombe.

It was interesting to listen to Manny during an interview on Maul or Nothing, he citied that after a bit of banter with the All Black's he no longer wanted one of their jersey's after the game. One of those talks was an eye to eye chat with Tamaiti Williams, there appear to be nothing between the lock and prop, just a lot of give and take. I thought TW angled in and caused Taylor to pop a few times, and that NZ were lucky to be rewarded.

f you have a forward of 6ft 8ins and 145kg, and he is not at all disturbed by a dysfunctional set-piece, you are in business.

He talked about the clarity of the leadership that helped alleviate any need for anxiety at the predicaments unfolding before him. The same cannot be said for New Zealand when they had 5 minutes left to retrieve a match winning penalty, I don't believe. Did the team in black have much of a plan at any point in the game? I don't really call an autonomous 10 vehicle they had as innovative. I think Razor needs to go back to the dealer and get a new game driver on that one.

Vaa’i is no match for his power on the ground. Even in reverse, Meafou is like a tractor motoring backwards in low gear, trampling all in its path.

Vaa'i actually stops him in his tracks. He gets what could have been a dubious 'tackle' on him?

A high-level offence will often try to identify and exploit big forwards who can be slower to reload, and therefore vulnerable to two quick plays run at them consecutively.

Yes he was just standing on his haunches wasn't he? He mentioned that in the interview, saying that not only did you just get up and back into the line to find the opposition was already set and running at you they also hit harder than anything he'd experienced in the Top 14. He was referring to New Zealands ultra-physical, burst-based Super style of course, which he was more than a bit surprised about. I don't blame him for being caught out.


He still sent the obstruction back to the repair yard though!

What wouldn’t the New Zealand rugby public give to see the likes of Mauvaka and Meafou up front..

Common now Nick, don't go there! Meafou showed his Toulouse shirt and promptly got his citizenship, New Zealand can't have him, surely?!?


As I have said before with these subjects, really enjoy your enthusiasm for their contribution on the field and I'd love to see more of their shapes running out for Vern Cotter and the like styled teams.

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