Geoff Parling’s last interview was for a Barbecue magazine. A blunt Teessider chucking a few prawns on the barbie in a leafy suburb of Melbourne. It is a curious image, not least for the man himself. “They said I was a 6ft 7ins athlete, but I’ve never been more than 6ft 5ins, and it was always an even bigger stretch to call me an athlete.”
That no-nonsense self-reflection is at the core of the ex-England and Lions second row’s make-up. It is also pivotal to the role he plays as lineout coach with Joe Schmidt’s Wallabies. There are so many moving parts which can go wrong with a modern professional lineout: the co-ordination between thrower and receiver, the timing and extension of the lift, the conviction of the decoys. If any of those cogs do not function, the machine fails. That is when a good lineout coach will slice through all the white noise and zero in on underlying causes – even if it all bounces back to him. Just cut to the chase.
The Welford Road favourite is characteristically forthright about the demise of the Melbourne Rebels, his previous coaching job. That last 2024 season still hurts, it is too close to home.
“I was just talking to [Rebels 10] Carter Gordon last week, who joined the NRL and moved to league,” Parling says. “Unfortunately, some guys have retired or haven’t picked up any work, but the bond with them goes far beyond rugby. You want them to succeed in life generally, not just at rugby.”
The intimacy of the bond created by that final campaign can be overstated. As New York Giants coach Bill Parcells once put it after a Superbowl win: “there is a blood transfusion. You get theirs and they get yours. Those guys look after each other, even to this very day.”
Some of that 2024 uncertainty has followed Parling into the Wallabies. Schmidt will be leaving halfway through a full four-year World Cup cycle, after the 2025 Rugby Championship, and others will go with him. Two old heads, scrum guru Mike Cron and breakdown and defence specialist ‘Lord’ Laurie Fisher will retire together. Two years of rebuilding work have passed in a flash.
Do I have a preference? Not really – at least as long as I can add value by what I do for a community, a city, even a nation.
Australian rugby is still caught in a rip-tide, and more than one Englishman may be riding its swirls and eddies. The man who picked Parling as his long-term lineout leader with England all the way back in 2012, Stuart Lancaster, may also be involved in the fate of the national team. Parling is still trying to keep his balance after the sudden collapse of the Rebels. Does he prefer the day-to-day grind of club footy, or the bigger highs and lows of the international game?
“I enjoy leading sessions and leading meetings so I do miss that day-to-day routine. But I also enjoy coaching at the top end of the game.
“Do I have a preference? Not really – at least as long as I can add value by what I do for a community, a city, even a nation.
“I have to feel like I am contributing positively to something greater than myself.”
Every question is balanced on a fine edge. As gently as I can, I ask whether the condensing of five Australian teams down to four has had a positive effect on the competitiveness of Aussie franchises.
“I won’t make a direct correlation, but I will say what I’m seeing in Super Rugby Pacific so far this season. Moana Pasifika just beat the Crusaders away from home, and nobody would have picked that beforehand.
“Our sides have been very competitive so far. Particularly at the end of games, when it really matters. They have looked fitter than they have done in the past, they have more belief in the final quarter than they have done in the past, and they have churned out some decent results.
“How they perform away in New Zealand will be critical. We are only in round seven but so far it’s been promising and the competition as a whole has restored excitement and anticipation.”
The conversation drifts naturally towards the big positive tweaks in Super Rugby officiating in 2025. But when it gets to his lineout speciality, blunt honesty takes over.
“I like how the tournament is being refereed in terms of pushing the tempo of the game. Compared to the game in Europe it is now very similar ball-in-play time but ball out-of-play may be averaging significantly less.
“Both referees and coaches are trying to be progressive about the lineout and scrum, trying to get the ball back on the pitch and playing on as quickly as possible.
“If the ball is at the back of the scrum and it goes down and there is no clear and obvious fault, I think it is absolutely right to play on. Play through whenever you can.
“I am not a big fan of not straight lineout throws being allowed if there is no contest in the air, and at times there can be a grey area around what constitutes a contest and what doesn’t.
“And I don’t like rewarding mediocrity – if a pass is forward, call it forward, regardless of whether there is defence in place or not. If the throw is not straight, just give a free kick rather than a scrum to keep the tempo high.”
I am quite happy to watch a three-all draw. I like the gladiatorial and strategic aspects of that contest.
I probe further. Would it be right to say Super Rugby and the Gallagher Premiership are the two most entertaining leagues in the world right now?
“The Prem often averages higher ball-in-play but the games are similar – both very high-scoring at the moment.
“The new rule about not being able to protect the receiver under a high ball has played a big part in it, creating far more unstructured situations which I guess, is good for the game.
“But I am quite happy to watch a three-all draw. I like the gladiatorial and strategic aspects of that contest. That’s a good thing, and I don’t think you need to have a super-high ball-in-play time to achieve that fascination and pull the onlooker in.
“Look at the NFL – not much ball-in-play, but it’s all about what you do tactically in the breaks between plays, so the game is still ‘live’ for the observer. They are still trying to follow the flow of thinking.
“Look at the Springboks. They habitually have low ball-in-play but they are still a bloody good side.
“Well-drilled, robust forwards combined with electrically-quick backs. I think Rassie and his team are innovative within their own formula for playing the game.
“It is stop-start and played in bursts, but when it is start your engine and it is ‘on’, it’s really on. They score far more tries from turnovers than people have been led to expect.”
The debate moves on to the nuts and bolts at lineout time, and I have a hard time getting Parling to name names, and highlight his picks for the upcoming series against the British and Irish Lions.
“I don’t like name-checking, but we are obviously monitoring all our players closely. How do they perform in the last three minutes with the game on the line?
“Do they make those double efforts when they are fatigued and out on their feet?”
I go through the options, looking for signs of approval, but they are few and far between. I mention the Western Force pair of Darcy Swain and Jeremy Williams, statistically the most productive lineout partnership in SRP 2025 so far. Between them, the duo has posted 48 takes on their own ball and 10 steals. I add the recent Reds-Force match showcased them at their best, and there is slight, but definite nod of acknowledgement.
In Aussie, only the Brumbies lineout leader Nick Frost comes close, with his 34 own-ball wins and six turnovers currently leading the competition. Beyond Frost and Swain, the only other veteran lineout leader in Australia is Queensland six Liam Wright, who is on the comeback trail from a long-term injury.
Wright started as an open-side flanker with the Reds before moving across to the other side of the scrum to accommodate the precocious talent of Fraser McReight. Picking Wright or his club-mate Seru Uru on the blindside flank would allow more wriggle room for Europe-based avowed non-jumper Will Skelton in the second row.
It would likely mean Australia switching to a 6-2 bench split, a shift Schmidt has been reluctant to contemplate up until now. Is Skelton in the frame for the Lions? “Of course he is,” replies Parling. He goes on to add a little more local colour to the debate.
You can put a forward in a back’s shirt. Think Levani Botia for La Rochelle and Fiji – a born hybrid player.
“At the lineout if you remember our back-row for most of last season – Fraser McReight, Bobby Valetini and Harry Wilson – we got some product out of Harry [at lineout] which he had never been asked to produce before.
“And over the whole season, he performed really well.
“But once again, it’s all about the right blend for the upcoming opponent and what the team needs.”
The flow moves on effortlessly from this point, as we chew over the rival bench theories in the modern game: multiple, flexible number sevens like England, or 7-1 power a la South Africa and France?
“I think it was [ex-New South Wales and Scotland coach] Matt Williams who called for the 6-2 and the 7-1 bench to be banned, but why should it be illegal?
“It’s within the rules, and you run the risk of early injuries in the backs and getting caught short there.
“So, I’ve got no problem with it at all, absolutely no problem. If more teams start doing it, I think it will promote the growth of back-row hybrids who can cover centre.”
I agree that Williams’ view may just be a bridge too far. Too puritanical. That goes down well in the Parling lexicon.
“’Puritanical’. Great word Nick, great word. It’s in my dictionary now.
“You can put a forward in a back’s shirt. Think Levani Botia for La Rochelle and Fiji – a born hybrid player.
“He can play seven and 12 equally well. Dylan Pietsch played as a flanker and he could probably still do it if he wanted to.”
The admiration for the Springboks and the contentment with a 3-3 draw march to the fore again. There is no reason for rugby to change if it means abandoning its historic appeal to diversity. Diversity of body types, diversity of tactical approach. Grow the game and make it faster by all means, but never lose sight of the opportunity to coach in a different way. There is room for all types, and disparate forms of thinking in rugby.
One aspect of the Australian game which has improved with the shrink to four franchises is the likelihood of more cohesion within the sub-units of the team. It makes that precious commodity, cohesion, potentially easier to achieve at national level.
“You always think about cohesion as a coach, whether that’s a group of people from the same club, or people who have history, who have played for you before. That’s Ben Darwin’s big thing at Gain-Line Analytics – Cohesion.
“Hooker and lineout caller, your eight and nine, how your two centres work together defensively, all those things [and many like them] fall under the banner of cohesion. You pick a guy who is the best for his position on the field, but also for how he relates to the people around him.”
We discuss the possibility of the sub-units of Australian provincial forward packs going into Test match battle together en bloc for the green-and-gold. The Force second row leads the lineout stats, the Reds front row of Alex Hodgman, Matt Faessler, with either Massimo de Lutiis or Zane Nongorr at tight-head have impressed at scrum-time with a healthy +10 in the pens won/lost column, second in the competition.
The Waratahs’ all-Wallaby trio of Angus Bell-Dave Porecki-Taniela Tupou are a short step behind on +8. With Allan Alaalatoa back to full fitness and Blake Schoupp and Billy Pollard developing alongside him, the Brumbies sit fourth on +6. With only the Chiefs ahead of those three, suddenly Australia can look forward to the scrum contest again.
The climax of Parling’s international career occurred on the 2013 Lions tour of Australia, when he was one of the very few non-Welsh forwards trusted by Wales head coach Warren Gatland in the final decisive Test. The Lions won that game 41-17 and Parling’s role as a leader was germinal to the win.
Now the situation is reversed, with one of England’s most recent ex-players, and possibly one of their ex-coaches looking to send the Lions homeward with their tails between their legs. If that story is to be told in July, it will come from a place where moral values supersede national allegiances.
“I have to feel like I am contributing positively to something greater than myself,” Parling says. “Just as long as I can add value by what I do for a community, a city, even a nation.”
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Howzit Nick! The two Geoff Ps are talking as well! About lineouts. The Reds losing one of very four throw-ins, only the Force nailing 9 of 10, but quality of ball very low, with LO callers knackered and hookers gassed and 9 less seconds of conference. Given that the four Aussie teams rely the most (the four highest %, all from 73 to 75%; in contrast to NZ teams at 50-60%) on set piece (ie lineout) to score tries, it’s a worry. On the shape/pace of game: I quite liked the spectacle of Munster v La Rochelle with its mini breaks.
Hi Harry.
LAR-Munster was great wasn’t it? Piece on that later this week. Jean Kleyn makes big diff!
The Reds obv have to set up their maul off lineout, and that didn’t work v the Force. It functioned ok v the Chiefs but the maul was stifled instead! Cannot have one without the other and that’s the besetting problem for the Reds atm.
Excellent wide ranging interview, Nick. “ I am quite happy to watch a three-all draw. I like the gladiatorial and strategic aspects of that contest.” I’m with Geoff all the way there ! Those results are very rare now. Really doubt if we will see such a result in this upcoming Lions series.
Things are getting interesting up in your hemisphere, Nick. That result in Dublin would not help Marcus Smith’s cause. The Munster win over LAR won’t harm Crowley’s cause. Craig Casey by all accounts has started back very strongly too. Their big test though will come next weekend down the coast in France. Bordeaux will be a far superior foe to the now deeply troubled LAR.
Down here, Waratah scrumhalf Teddy Wilson I like. Also the ex Rebel Josh Canham has hit he ground running with the Reds.
It’s tough to rise to that level and win away two weeks running vs quality opposition, even for Munster.
Overall I’d say Crowley is ahead of SP atm, no doubt over SP potential but he’s still got a way to go and actually deliver on it. That said, if he manages to steer Leinster to the CC this year, and he might just do exactly that, well all bets are off in that scenario…
Jeez you’re lucky if you see 3-3 after 10 minutes now Miz!
I think Crowley will have scored more points than Prendergast because of the opponent. I don’t have Marcus in the same basket because of his utlity value. I think Faz will take him anyway.
It’s the Munster team I recall from when they won the URC, so anticipate they will give UBB a very strong go.
Great to see a true expert who knows that elapsed time is just as important as ball in play time 😂 Less opportunity to rest.
We had a bit of a debate about that! Geoff reckoned there might as muhc as 5-6 mins less ball-out-of-play time compared to the Prem, but in the games I’ve watched it’s closer to 1-2 minutes😁
One of the best interviews I’ve read in some time, GP comes across as a real thinking man’s coach. Already had the view that the Lions tour wasn’t going to be the walkover many expect but with coaches like that and, by the sound of it, SL to come, it might just prove to be a proper contest after all!
Yes he’s always thoughtful in his responses so it is an enjoyable exercise Ed. It would be ironic if two ex-England players and coaches are in the Aussie camp - the IP battle prob falls out in favour of the hosts!
He's gone from geography teacher to professor hasn't he?
Good interviewer too!
Thanks Nick. Sounds like he’s enjoying the role. Is he contracted till 27? Sorry if you already wrote that in the article.
Swain and Williams are looking good but Frost and Skelton does appeal. From what Parling says Skelton might be brought home fle the Lions.
I didn’t ask about his contract, but I’m assuming he’d be done until the RWC in 2027, like Eoin Toolan. I hope the WBs keep him.
The great thing with Williams is that they can move him to 6 if Skelton plays 4, and that gives he WB a very imposing back five forwards.
Thanks Nick. He’s always seemed a decent bloke. Our lineout struggled for a while under his stewardship and the Rebels were never great but it feels like we won’t be beaten at set piece in July so the coaches are doing a lot right.
I think the WB set piece is fast emerging as one of the strengths of their game DM. Esp if they can include Will Skelton ofc. And get Taniela humming again!
The Rebels situation is understandably a touchy subject for Geoff Parling but I’m currently listening to a podcast with Mat Rogers who bluntly said “the best thing to happen to Australian rugby union in the last 15 years is the Melbourne Rebels going broke”, citing the better spread of talent across Australian rugby.
Having Skelton in the squad for the Lions series is a must. Yes he’s a 2nd rower who's a lineout lifter instead of a lineout jumper but his mongrel is essential as displayed against Wales in November.
As for the 7-1 bench split, I flip flop between praising Rassie Erasmus and Fabien Galthie for playing to their team’s strengths and being willing to embrace the trade-off that comes with a 7-1 bench composition but also believing World Rugby should stipulate that a bench must have at least 2 specialist backs.
I don’t think you can argue against the better depth in Aussie rugby with 4 sides Mitch. But the emotional link is obv still strong for Geoff.
LAR tried to get a couple of jumps out of Skelton v Munster, leading to clear sense of alarm among his supposed lifters! It did not have a good ending…
Rassie Erasmus, Mitch…I read one interesting article on the Chiefs win over the Reds where the author was giving Rassie some credit in that Clayton MacMillan is employed a bomb squad of sorts.
I don’t think there can be any doubt that the shrink from 5 to 4 hs improved Aussie competitiveness Mitch, and that will breed confidence… That last 20-30 mins is directly influenced by quality off the bench after all.
I don’t thnik there is any chance of WR demanding specilaist back off the pine though. It’s up to opoonents to upset the strategy and expose the risks being taken!