The tubae and buccinae are sounding, brazen shields are being beaten and the battlelines are beginning to harden, after Antoine Dupont’s Olympic gold medal in the Men’s Sevens. On the one hand, an army of rugby supporters who firmly believe that the French wizard has now ascended to the status of G.O.A.T [greatest-of-all-time]; on the other, a host who will never accept a man from north of the equator as the best in the world in his own time, let alone the best of all time.
Is Dupont a better scrum-half than Fourie Du Preez, or Aaron Smith, or Joost Van Der Westhuizen from previous eras, or even Leinster and Ireland’s Jamison Gibson-Park in the current generation? In the middle of such a ferociously parochial debate, you need a judge who treads the fine margins of bias without ever losing balance, the one who inhabits the invaluable in-between.
That man is ex-Crusader, and six-time Super Rugby champion scrum-half turned Aotearoa rugby podcast pundit Bryn Hall. Hall knows what he is talking about and he comes from the south, and these were his comments after watching the 2024 Champions Cup Final between Dupont’s club Stade Toulousain and Leinster:
“There are just so many highlights that you could point out. [Leinster hooker Dan] Sheehan made that big line-break, [Dupont] had the ball stripped from him but he comes all the way back, Sheehan almost scores the try and Dupont gets the steal just five metres from the line.
“There are so many things that Dupont can do very, very well. Defensively, on attack, kicking; he is your full threat.
“If he gets a World Cup win in the next cycle – hopefully not for the Kiwis, but for the French – you would have to put him down as possibly being the best player that’s ever played [the game].
“He has to be in that argument with the way he is able to play at international level and obviously with Toulouse – and we haven’t even touched on Sevens. He is probably going to go and win a gold medal at the Olympics. That’s another great thing about Dupont, is that he hasn’t even been in there full-time this year with Toulouse, he’s been playing Sevens!”
I am going to have to make sacrifices to spend time with this team and get used to this special game and discipline. I am hoping to be at my peak and challenge at the Olympics
Antoine Dupont
There are caveats – Dupont needs to win a be part of a World-Cup winning outfit, or at least, part of a successful, series-winning tour of New Zealand or South Africa with France. At the same time, his ability to operate in so many different areas of the game so effectively – with ball in hand, on defence, and in the kicking game marks him out as probably the best pure rugby-player of the lot. He can be the greatest player without being necessarily the best No 9.
If that is the reason why he can be part of a Sevens program for only six months and contribute to it so mightily and immediately, it is also a cast-iron qualification for the title of G.O.AT. Others like New Zealanders Dan Carter, Ben Smith and Kieran Read, and Springbok Danie Gerber would probably fall into the same category.
The other qualification is that a player begins to transcend his own speciality sport and reach out to a new audience, a new cross-section of the public:
“I now hope to perform well. For any sports fan, the Olympics remain mythical. The fact we are hosting the Games in France means it’s going to be an incredible party to [hopefully] be a part of.
“I am going to have to make sacrifices to spend time with this team and get used to this special game and discipline. I am hoping to be at my peak and challenge at the Olympics.”
After Les Bleus’ gold medal-winning performance against Fiji, Dupont was already being painted as the new French President on social media. Despite starting a few days before the official opening ceremony to avoid the eternal space-jostle with Swimming and Athletics, Sevens was suddenly no longer an Olympic side-show, it was now a centrepiece. 69,000 fans packed into the Stade de France, heaving, swaying and chanting, “Qui ne saute pas n’est pas Français. ‘He who does not jump is not French’.” It was a direct reference to Antoine Dupont’s jump into another time-warp, and a new dimension as sporting hero.
For any serious student of the game, the main point of interest orbited around the adaptation of le petit general’s skills to a new format. As ex-Harlequins’ #10 Will Edwards explained,
Antoine Dupont typically had only five minutes in the second half of games to show his wares, and transform the outcomes for his team.
“The general rugby skill-set [between Sevens and Fifteens] is very similar. [But] each small detail is highlighted ‘to the Nth degree’ because it is seven players on a 15-a-side pitch.
“Missing one tackle in a fifteens game, you are normally backed up by a mate; if you miss a tackle on a sevens pitch, they are probably going to go and score. It puts your one-on-one ability in all facets of the game under the spotlight.
“[Dupont] will be fit enough, but it is a very different type of fitness. Sevens is at 90 per cent of your max speed for 14 minutes straight in the heat, and there are not as many breaks in play. How your body deals with it is different.”
All the one-on-one skills – tackling, jackaling, running, passing and supporting are performed at high-speed and the aerobic demands are sustained. Antoine Dupont typically had only five minutes in the second half of games to show his wares, and transform the outcomes for his team.
In the last two matches against the Blitzbokke and the flying Fijians, the score blew out from 0-0 to 19-5 in the semi-final, and from 7-7 to 26-7 in the final after Dupont’s arrival on the field. While the little magician was in situ, the total score was 38-5 in favour of France. In only 12 minutes of playing-time, he scored two tries, had two try-assists while contributing three other break-makers and making one defensive turnover.
The variety of the roles France found for their diminutive genius in that short span was bewildering. Defensively, France used Dupont in the same way that a #7 is employed in fifteens, as the first man in over the tackle ball:
At two consecutive tackles on both 15m lines, first left then right, Dupont is the first man on-ball, and the would-be pilferer after a tackle has been completed. In general play, he often dropped back to the defensive sweeper role, as a Sevens’ version of the #15 in the backfield.
On attack he tended to stand at second receiver with the full width available, running an arc towards the outside half of the field, demanding that tacklers plant their feet to defend him and creating space for others to exploit:
In midfield, he shifted up one spot to first receiver on the same mission:
Translate that ability to the 5m line, and Dupont became a very lethal weapon indeed from tapped penalty situations:
The final finished with Antoine Dupont playing hooker, first throwing into the lineout, and then marshalling the maul thereafter. With the benefit of an extra 10 to 15 kilos or so on his chunky frame, he could quite comfortably fill the same role in rugby fifteens:
If there is the embryonic mindset of a forward, a #2 or a #7 lurking somewhere in the man, it has not either cancelled or supplanted the essential romance of the French rugby spirit. Oh no, far from it:
This was Dupont’s first action of the final after coming on for the second period. It was also his most brilliant thrust, straight from the opening kick-off. He was leaving history in his wake. The man he is escaping down the left side-line is none other than Jerry Tuwai, one of the most outstanding Sevens schemers of his era and a worthy successor to the likes of Waisale Serevi.
As his coach Osea Kolinisau explained, “Jerry leaves footprints in the sand for other boys to follow. After he is gone, I think we are going to see there was only one Jerry Tuwai.” If that is true statement of his stature in the game, how to assess the performance of the man who beat him, after only six months spent in a setting he barely understood?
The case for Antoine Dupont as G.O.A.T is still burgeoning, but unproven. A gold medal at his home Olympics in Paris will only add to the lustrous myth surrounding the man. From the dark cavern of a Phantom of the Opera face-mask and World Cup heartache out into the light of gilded triumph in the space of ten short months. It has been some journey.
For now, Antoine Dupont’s claim will rest on the translate-ability of his talent from Fifteens to Sevens, and the versatility to combine the features of a #2, a #7, a #9, a #10, a #12 and #15 all in the same frame held together by one backbone. That, and his growing reach beyond rugby, touching a new audience and transcending his sport.
Antoine Dupont has joined the modern rugby gods on Olympus -the greatest athlete to play rugby [Jonah Lomu at his peak], and the all-rounders who understood all aspects of the game so deeply – Dan Carter, Kieran Read, Ben Smith and Danie Gerber. For now, he will have to be content to be one-among-many, to sit on a mountain-top with fellow titans – but no Zeus.
Dan Carter is still the GOAT. IMHO.
Let’s not forget what a spectacular player he was. It wasn’t that long ago.
And that’s the problem with this type of debate. It’s meaningless fun. I may never have even seen the best player to ever play the game, play the game. I’d have to take someone’s word for it, watch some old YouTube highlights or read some stats to be better equipped to make the argument.
But I know what I saw with my own eyes and how I felt watching Dan Carter destroy other teams, my own included.
Yes that would be my instinct too, I think DC is the most complete player of the lot. Could kick equally well with both feet, pass either way, run with the speed of a backfield player etc... And that defensive 7-10 seam was secure for years with DC and Richie....
I believe it is hard to crown a player the best of all time when so much depends on the teams he has played with and against. It is impossible to hold a teamloss like the WC against a player as evidence he is not the greatest OAT. In an individual sport like athletics, tennis (singles) and swimming, there is far more empirical evidence on which to base such conclusions. In a team sport it is impossible to say how great anyone would have been if they had played for another team. Herb Elliott, Bob Beamon, Usain Bolt would all qualify as the greatest ever in their disciplines. in a very subjective approach my vote for the five best rugby players would go to Colin Meads, Serge Blanco, Gareth Edwards John Eales and Danie Craven. I would add Danie Gerber but then I would have to leave out Doc Craven to be fair.
Not a bad list Graham. Even harder to compare players from the amateur era to the current pros, the game is moving at such a rate.
One of the good aspects of American Sports is that players do not have to belong to the most successful clubs in order to appear in the All-Star games.
Maybe WR could think of having a North v South All-Star game annually?
This French team have hardly set the world alight, a WC quarter-final exit and one six-nations win in recent years.
Which begs the question, how does a team with the supposed GOAT and a bevy of world-class players fail to make a significant mark?
Ireland and the Boks have shone more brightly in recent years without GOAT claims. Do they have a significant world-class player advantage over France, enough to make up for a GOAT? If so, why were the French favourites for the last World Cup with many of their players being lauded as world-class.
It seems to me that the French players are generally over-rated given their on-field results.
Does this include Dupont? Probably and I think the onus is on him to prove otherwise.
Many French players failed to show up in a QF that could have gone both ways. And dominating SA as much as they did without scoring enough is rare.
Besides Dupont’s cheekbone (ask MBappé how does it feel to play with a mask), loosing NTamack was probably way more important - not as brilliant in attack as Jalibert, but better game management and better defender. In a close game like that one, it counts. More than Marx’s injury? Seeing Mbonambi’s incredible RWC, maybe.
And in a 1 point game when a conversion was highly controversial, as well as the last penalty with Kwagga Smith having hands on the ground before the turn-over, I wouldn’t talk about choking. Choking is like SA bested everyone, while NZ, England and France were horrible. Nope. 1 point games. It’s not 2019, where there was no discussion, SA was by far the best team.
So when your best player is injured and doesn’t play at 100%, all the players around are focused on him (there’s almost no game anymore without an anti-Dupont plan), especially Faf, how can you possibly say it’s choking? How can you think being objective in that situation?
See how he “choked” in the last 3 finals he played in recent months.
This sport is so even for the top teams that even a small detail now can have huge consequences. See Mostert or Le Roux’s injuries against Ireland in the second game? It seemed to have derailed the game plan. These details matter, and talking about choking is just the proof of how delusional we can be from our couches talking about things we do not control and cannot even imagine to what extent those guys master it.
France could claim with some justification that they were unlucky not to get pas the Boks in the quarters. Ben O’Keefe acknowledged as much after the event.
But tbh there were four teams all even money to win the event before it started, and the margins between them all were paper-close.
The knockouts cannot sadly be used as a measure of Anoitne Dupont as he was playing with a broken bone in his face, and understandably more tentative than usual.
It’s his influence on games that makes him a contender for GOAT. Whether its try saving tackle, a break or backing up to clinch a try he has a greater influence on match outcomes than any single player I can remember
Yes it’s an excellent common-sense way to look at it. How many times do his contrbutions change the course of games? The Sevens stats picture tell the tale.
He may not be,…but shit he's good
I can understand the argument that you don’t need to have won a World Cup to be considered the ‘GOAT’ (look at Jonah Lomu as a good example) but Dupont is going to have to show his greatness in both hemispheres just like Fourie du Preez and Aaron Smith have done just to be regarded as the greatest scrumhalf of this generation.
Yes I think he will need to do that - Gareth Edwards did not really gain any traction until he had won with the Lions in NZ in 1971 and SA in 1974.
Thanks Nick, really enjoyed both of your last two articles.
Here, I feel like you have also reminded people of the relevance of debate around Dupont. I also put him in that “one of your all time favourite players” category, rather than the best player in his, or any, position.
It reflects much about how Lionel Messi was viewed half a decade ago I think, especially when compared to his polar opposite player type at the time, Ronaldo, the man with records and from what I can remember, the plaudits, for largely being the best at what they do, striking. Dupont may not be the best half back by his contribution towards his teams winning, but he does it in the best style, and the most (more) inspiring way (and for what I would believe would be many peoples).
At the Olympics, Dupont looked like all 15s converts have done after just 6 months playing the game, a handbrake to his team. I’m so happy for him that he was lucky enough to win this one, it must mean so much to him after the heartbreak at what befell him at the World Cup with that tackle. There is many a great player that did not even get to win as much as he has till now, will he also pull off a Messi at the end of his career?
Yes he’s one of those guys you want on your side. He frequently plays 10 for Toulouse in the late-game, and he has added elements of 7 to his game too.
He just finds a way to win in so many areas, and a real sham he was not fully fit for the RWC versus the Boks last year in 15’s.
I think their is a few women in the NZ 7s side that won their 2nd Olympic medal and have also won at least 1 WC in 15s and Portia Woodman-Whitcliffe has won 2 Golds, 1 silver, 2 15s WCs and plenty more comps.
I love watching the best players and Dupont is one of those at the moment. I think these GOAT claims are way over the top. Great player to watch tho for sure.
Hard to evaluate the women in rugby because the sport is so new, compared to the men’s game.
I think Dupont is there or thereabouts, though we do need to see where he stops before making a conclusive judgment.
I don’t even think he is the greatest 9 of all time.
Joost van der Westhuizen, George Gregan, Fourie de Preez, and Aaron Smith were all significantly better halfbacks than DuPont in my opinion.
At test level, France hardly ever wins anything- one Six Nations championship maybe? Quarter-final defeats in 2019 and 2023.
What about Gareth Edwards going a bit further back? A better version of Joost??
I think you’d have hard time proving that the four you mention are all better 9’s than Dupont. You could argue that they were just as dominant in their time, but time has moved on and the game is faster and more demanding now than it was then.
AD has probably added more to the understanding of the spot [and what can be done from it] than any of the others?
Could not agree more SC. I would not even rate him the current best no 9 let alone in the same category as the player you mentioned. Does not even come close to Joost who was unbelievably dangerous on the field, almost scoring a try in every second test match.
Wait till we see the effects the “Dupont” law will have on him. People are going to find out why they called it the Dupont law…
“There are caveats – Dupont needs to win a be part of a World-Cup winning outfit, or at least, part of a successful, series-winning tour of New Zealand or South Africa with France.”
I am sorry but this makes no sense. Ireland won a series in NZ. Does this mean that any of Ireland’s travelling squad could be technically qualified to be called GOAT but not Antoine Dupont?
Also only one NH team has EVER won a RWC. That rules out ALL NH players at the moment.
What is the substantiation for applying these requirements?
The last RWC was down to too much luck by view of the draw and scheduling. So its a coin flick to see if Dupont could be considered GOAT depending on if his team gets lucky or not.
Also France have beaten NZ twice by 14+ last two matches. Why would they need to beat them in NZ? They are better? Is any tour OK? If France beat Australia, Argentina? Or is it that they must beat the current strong SH team?
Just need more substantiation for why these team requirements that rule out nearly every NH player, need to be applied ? It seems a very blunt instrument where DuPont.
Folks should wind their necks in on this subject before it destroys this man’s career. Yes, he’s a good player but greatness is decided over a career not on a few seasons.
Honestly, I don’t see what all the fuss is about DuPont. He was average at best the first 6 years of his career and only started to shine when Cheslin Kolbe was playing for Toulouse.
You would think that people would use some stats to see how well a player is performing, like his 13 tries from 52 test matches with a strike rate of 0.25 to date. Nothing outstanding, lousy strike rate for somebody being touted like he is, but again it’s not the end of his career just yet.
I can also point out that people are oblivious to the fact that there is another currently active international scrumhalf with 13 tries from 33 test matches, with a strike rate of 0.39 that is second only to the late great Joost van der Westhuizen who ended with 38 tries from 89 test matches and a strike rate of 0.43.
He has also scored more hat-tricks and won more RWC’s than DuPont so why are we not calling him the GOAT?
It really seems like Dupont being lauded as the best current rugby player is diminishing SA’s successes.
It isn’t.
Kolbe shone greatly in 1 season at Toulouse, the 2018/2019 when they got back at top of the French and won the Top14. But after that, he was average. Kicked an incredible drop at the 2021 Top 14 final and that’s it. But he was certainly at the basis of every Toulouse and Dupont’s success right? Come on mate. Ugo Mola, Jerome Kaino, Baille, Marchand, Cros, NTamack were all in there to make it happen since 2018. Cheslin had his part, but he’s not Dupont’s mentor. The guy was already a freak in Castres - you can look up the reels on YT.
Guys, be happy having won 2 back to back RWC despite not having the best player in your team! SA 1995 and Australia 1999 didn’t have Lomu and still were crowned. It just shows the team is more important, and that’s nothing to feel frustrated about.
Parisse was probably a better player than McCaw, but played for Italy. And McCaw would have never won 2 RWC playing for Italy.
Still, apparently writing DuPont seems a way of owning him.
He’s not South African. He’s French. And he’s called Antoine Dupont.
Come on Wayneo, surely you dont want 33 test players to be called GOATs. 100 Test players do it for much longer. Durability is a crucial part of being the GOAT. Having said that I think the concept of a GOAT is a difficult one to detirmine but I doubt Dupont will ever be in a short list. Would he be a top 10 9s ever??? Maybe.
How do you manage to connect Dupont’s success to Kolbe’s arrival? Bit of a stretch even for a nailed on Bok fan!
I first studied him while he was still the #2 halfback at Castres as a teenager, and we devoted an indecent amount of prep to a bloke who had played so little top-level rugby! He was that good.
The try-scoring measure is flatulent at best. All it really shows is a 9 who tends to look for opportunities around the ruck [South African playbook] - I’d guess Aaron Smith’s rate was around the same as Dupont’s, as was Fourie du Preez’s: mid-to-late twenties at best.
George Gregan scored 18 tries in 139 Tests for Australia, but he was essential to his team’s success. Does that exclude him from the debate?
I think Joost was a great player - just like Gareth Edwards - and he could have played Sevens too. But I don’t think he had Dupont’s range of skills.